Bin Laden ex-driver found guilty
A US military jury at Guantanamo Bay has convicted Osama Bin Laden's former driver of supporting terrorism.
The verdict on Salim Hamdan is the first to be delivered in a full war crimes trial at the US prison in Cuba.
The jury found Hamdan guilty of five of eight charges of supporting terrorism but acquitted him of two separate, more serious, charges of conspiracy.
A sentencing hearing is now under way. Hamdan, a Yemeni aged about 40, faces a maximum sentence of life in prison.
The White House said the trial was fair and looked forward to more tribunals.
The defence team has said it plans to appeal, while rights groups have condemned the trial as unjust.
In its first response, the White House said Hamdan had received a "fair trial".
Spokesman Tony Fratto said: "The Military Commission system is a fair and appropriate legal process... We look forward to other cases moving forward to trial."
However, defence lawyers had said they feared a guilty verdict was inevitable and that the system was geared to convict.
Rights group Amnesty International said the trial was "fundamentally flawed" and called for all the remaining military tribunals to be halted and for proceedings to be moved to civilian courts.
full story:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/7545484.stm
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What are some reasons further cases should be moved to a civilian court? What are some reasons they should stay as they are, military tribunals?
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"What country can preserve its liberties if its rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms." --Thomas Jefferson to William Stephens Smith, 1787.
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Will they be arresting the the shoe shine boy next?
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Your english is pretty bad, learn some gramma - then get back.
Cooks, waiters, tailors, taxi drivers, shoe makers and stewardesses beware!
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Daar is de lente, daar is de zon bijna, maar ik denk dat ze weldra zal komen. De fallus impudicus staat al in bloei En de blaadjes krijgen bomen. M'n vrouw en m'n kat zijn allebei krols en de klokken vertrekken naar Rome
Will they be arresting the the shoe shine boy next?
Sure, if he has two shoulder launched missiles in his shoe shine box.....among other things.
-Bruce
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"Faith is Action, Based upon Belief, Sustained by Confidence in God's Word and His promise to perform it" ---Dr. Gene Scott
Bin Laden driver given 66 months [why can't they just say it in years?]
Osama Bin Laden's former driver has been sentenced to five-and-a-half years in prison at the first US military trial in Guantanamo Bay.
Salim Hamdan was convicted on Wednesday of supporting terrorism, but acquitted of conspiracy to murder.
Prosecutors had demanded a sentence of not less than 30 years.
On time served Hamdan could be released in five months but the Pentagon has said he will still be retained as an "enemy combatant".
The US has always argued it can detain such people indefinitely, as long as its so-called war on terror continues.
The Pentagon said Hamdan would serve his sentence and then be eligible for review.
The jury of six US military officers, not the judge, imposed the sentence under the tribunal rules.
Our correspondent says Hamdan looked nervous as he walked in for sentencing but after hearing it, he told jurors: "I would like to apologise one more time to all the members and I would like to thank you for what you have done for me."
The judge, Navy Capt Keith Allred, told Hamdan: "I hope the day comes when you return to your wife and your daughters and your country."
Hamdan, who is aged about 40, smiled as he left court and said thank you to those in the room.
full story:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/7547261.stm
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"What country can preserve its liberties if its rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms." --Thomas Jefferson to William Stephens Smith, 1787.
This war against terrorism allows everything stuff reminds me to the Inquisition(s) in my country. It was introduced to give people a big spectacle. Thats the only use of it.
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"Vor allem bewahrt Euch stets die Fähigkeit, jede Ungerechtigkeit, die irgendwo auf der Welt begangen wird, aufs Tiefste zu empfinden. " Che Guevara
This war against terrorism allows everything stuff reminds me to the Inquisition(s) in my country. It was introduced to give people a big spectacle. Thats the only use of it.
Oh really Ducky? Is that ALL? I wish I could go through life with blinders on like yours. It allows muslim terrorist scum to face justice. If that's a bad thing to you..perhaps it is just that you wish them free to slaughter innocents. Is that it?
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"Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it, misdiagnosing it and them misapplying the wrong remedies." --Groucho Marx
zapped, if you live in a land where these things are legal (I know there's like legal meetings where people go shoot with canons, tanks and what not), then don't condemn others. Taxi driver can be a dangerous profession, so it seems, he should be able to protect himself.
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Daar is de lente, daar is de zon bijna, maar ik denk dat ze weldra zal komen. De fallus impudicus staat al in bloei En de blaadjes krijgen bomen. M'n vrouw en m'n kat zijn allebei krols en de klokken vertrekken naar Rome
It allows muslim terrorist scum to face justice. If that's a bad thing to you..perhaps it is just that you wish them free to slaughter innocents. Is that it?
What is justice in this context then? To catch as much muslime (men) as possible and keep them in jail (or better: cage) and away from law as long as possible?
Justice can never be granted if the judge is one of the concerned parties.
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"Vor allem bewahrt Euch stets die Fähigkeit, jede Ungerechtigkeit, die irgendwo auf der Welt begangen wird, aufs Tiefste zu empfinden. " Che Guevara
It allows muslim terrorist scum to face justice. If that's a bad thing to you..perhaps it is just that you wish them free to slaughter innocents. Is that it?
What is justice in this context then? To catch as much muslime (men) as possible and keep them in jail (or better: cage) and away from law as long as possible?
Justice can never be granted if the judge is one of the concerned parties.
Who told you that? Get your money back. Justice is getting what one deserves. And dead is a good thing for muslim terrorst scum. But you have to go lie again didn't you.... Seeing the thousands of picture of muslim men freely walking (because they aren't the terrorst scum) right besides those who have the mission of bringing the muslim terrorist to justice, you again prove you aren't being honest
in this matter. Admit it Ducky. You don't give a flip about the innocents. You feel the freedom to murder is a muslim terrorist's right.
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"Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it, misdiagnosing it and them misapplying the wrong remedies." --Groucho Marx
Who told you that? Get your money back. Justice is getting what one deserves. And dead is a good thing for muslim terrorst scum. But you have to go lie again didn't you.... Seeing the thousands of picture of muslim men freely walking (because they aren't the terrorst scum) right besides those who have the mission of bringing the muslim terrorist to justice, you again prove you aren't being honest in this matter. Admit it Ducky. You don't give a flip about the innocents. You feel the freedom to murder is a muslim terrorist's right.
If justice is what one deserves and these terrorists deserve to die, what deserve the people who gave the terrorists reason and possibility to kill?! To die several times?!
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"Vor allem bewahrt Euch stets die Fähigkeit, jede Ungerechtigkeit, die irgendwo auf der Welt begangen wird, aufs Tiefste zu empfinden. " Che Guevara
If justice is what one deserves and these terrorists deserve to die, what deserve the people who gave the terrorists reason and possibility to kill?!
Reason, is there ever reason/s for terrorist acts, you seem to be attempting to validate acts of terrorism, would you rather, like the ostrich, bury your head in the sand and hope they would miss you out, or placate these poor little misguided misfits of our world, pat them on the head and send them home to mummy and daddy? To die several times?!
Yep, if not. hung, drawn and quartered and the bill sent to their families…
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"Save a child use a condom"
The bill sent to their families!!! have you Jim been studying stalin???I seem to recall ,,he did that..
The bill sent to their families!!! have you Jim been studying stalin???I seem to recall ,,he did that..
My good friend Joe 
Treat terror with a greater terror, with terrorists the normal rules are set aside, the only right they have is death….
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"Save a child use a condom"
Why their families? What did they do, and if they did do anything, then they would be dead, and it would be impossible for them to pay.
And yes, there is always a reason for terrorrism. If you don't get that, then you won't solve a thing.
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Daar is de lente, daar is de zon bijna, maar ik denk dat ze weldra zal komen. De fallus impudicus staat al in bloei En de blaadjes krijgen bomen. M'n vrouw en m'n kat zijn allebei krols en de klokken vertrekken naar Rome
Why their families? What did they do, and if they did do anything, then they would be dead, and it would be impossible for them to pay.
“Treat terror with a greater terror” = there is a greater price to pay for the terrorist than their own lives, their actions have repercussions for those who they may hold dear..
And yes, there is always a reason for terrorrism. If you don't get that, then you won't solve a thing.
There is no acceptable reason, if you accept there are reasons you validate the action….
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"Save a child use a condom"
And so punish the innocent for something someone else did? Maybe Bin Laden is right to kill all Americans because the English once coloniced. You first say no reason is good enough, and then that terror has to be for the innocent families and dears... well, the other way around, but anyways. You, sir, have a damn retarded hypocrite view on this..
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Daar is de lente, daar is de zon bijna, maar ik denk dat ze weldra zal komen. De fallus impudicus staat al in bloei En de blaadjes krijgen bomen. M'n vrouw en m'n kat zijn allebei krols en de klokken vertrekken naar Rome
And so punish the innocent for something someone else did?
like the victims of terrorist acts, who may or may not have supported their governments past or present acts?
Maybe Bin Laden is right to kill all Americans because the English once coloniced.
Now you have lost me, terrorists are terrorists irrespective of their nationality or creed, victims are victims and the victims and their families, will and do remain paramount for me, not some scummy terrorist or their families.
You first say no reason is good enough, and then that terror has to be for the innocent families and dears... well, the other way around, but anyways.
Terror who stated terror, I said repercussions.
You, sir, have a damn retarded hypocrite view on this..
Maybe so, but that’s an accident of birth on my part, you sir are a self made, man….
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"Save a child use a condom"
No, you stated terror “Treat terror with a greater terror”.
some brothers of Bin Laden (also Bin Laden btw) are completely innocent, and have always been with 'the West.' the just born baby of the sister of a terrorrist is innocent. if you hurt that beby to make the terrorrist suffer, than what's the difference between you and the terrorrist? Your words to hurt the ones dear to a terrorrist.My words: you are no better. Except maybe that you don't have the guts to go blow up yourself in Kaboom or whatever.
What you preach is escalation, not sollution.
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Daar is de lente, daar is de zon bijna, maar ik denk dat ze weldra zal komen. De fallus impudicus staat al in bloei En de blaadjes krijgen bomen. M'n vrouw en m'n kat zijn allebei krols en de klokken vertrekken naar Rome
“Treat terror with a greater terror, with terrorists the normal rules are set aside, the only right they have is death” please note, no mention of families… “Send the families the bill“, cost of the bullet, rope or rusty nail, repatriation of the scumbags remains..
Except maybe that you don't have the guts to go blow up yourself in Kaboom or whatever.
Like all childish remarks and actions, ignored. 
What you preach is escalation, not sollution.
Unlike you, Capitulation for me is not an option...
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"Save a child use a condom"
And so punish the innocent for something someone else did? Maybe Bin Laden is right to kill all Americans because the English once coloniced. You first say no reason is good enough, and then that terror has to be for the innocent families and dears... well, the other way around, but anyways. You, sir, have a damn retarded hypocrite view on this..
Technically...shouldn't it be the British colonised them?
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Your english is pretty bad, learn some gramma - then get back.
And so punish the innocent for something someone else did? Maybe Bin Laden is right to kill all Americans because the English once coloniced. You first say no reason is good enough, and then that terror has to be for the innocent families and dears... well, the other way around, but anyways. You, sir, have a damn retarded hypocrite view on this..
Technically...shouldn't it be the British colonised them?Predominantly English, Ed, on the look out for some natives to exploit and find an alternative for Crimbo dinner…
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"Save a child use a condom"
Oh, and as we are mentioning colonisation, didn’t Belgium do a little of that in the Congo?
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"Save a child use a condom"
Cook did that in when he finished off the Dodo, swine!
Shooting Natives in the Congo doesn't compare to owning 1/4 of the globe.
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Your english is pretty bad, learn some gramma - then get back.
Cook did that in when he finished off the Dodo, swine! Shooting Natives in the Congo doesn't compare to owning 1/4 of the globe.
But,
½ the population in a 40 year period would be going for it even for the Brit’s, Ed.
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"Save a child use a condom"
Systematicly killing the natives?
Just realised how we're indirectly going off topic.
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Your english is pretty bad, learn some gramma - then get back.
Who told you that? Get your money back. Justice is getting what one deserves. And dead is a good thing for muslim terrorst scum. But you have to go lie again didn't you.... Seeing the thousands of picture of muslim men freely walking (because they aren't the terrorst scum) right besides those who have the mission of bringing the muslim terrorist to justice, you again prove you aren't being honest in this matter. Admit it Ducky. You don't give a flip about the innocents. You feel the freedom to murder is a muslim terrorist's right.
If justice is what one deserves and these terrorists deserve to die, what deserve the people who gave the terrorists reason and possibility to kill?! To die several times?!
So you ARE a muslim terrorist apologist it seems. I had hoped more from you Ducky. Well...I still won't laugh to hard when they come after you and yours if that is the case. It is people with your attitude that allowed them free reign for so long. If anyone is responsible...it is those with your thinking. So by your logic...You deserve to die.
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"Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it, misdiagnosing it and them misapplying the wrong remedies." --Groucho Marx
So yes, if thinking in the lines of some here, then the Congolese have reason enough to come and shoot around here. Apparently, they did find the guns and machetes, but not the way out of Congo. More... most want us to come back.
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Daar is de lente, daar is de zon bijna, maar ik denk dat ze weldra zal komen. De fallus impudicus staat al in bloei En de blaadjes krijgen bomen. M'n vrouw en m'n kat zijn allebei krols en de klokken vertrekken naar Rome
So you ARE a muslim terrorist apologist it seems. I had hoped more from you Ducky. Well...I still won't laugh to hard when they come after you and yours if that is the case. It is people with your attitude that allowed them free reign for so long. If anyone is responsible...it is those with your thinking. So by your logic...You deserve to die.
Nope, I'm not a muslim terrorist apologist. But I think I can understand the reasons why there are muslim terrorists. And I think I know that it doesn't help to go headless crazy.
Speaking of responsibles: Who supported the Talibans, Al Quaida, Iran, Iraq, Pinochet etc without any thought for the consequences? Now these consequences are showing. USA has to pay the bills for their foreing policy. Thats all. Nothing to complain about. Just carry it as if you are a man.
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"Vor allem bewahrt Euch stets die Fähigkeit, jede Ungerechtigkeit, die irgendwo auf der Welt begangen wird, aufs Tiefste zu empfinden. " Che Guevara
So you ARE a muslim terrorist apologist it seems. I had hoped more from you Ducky. Well...I still won't laugh to hard when they come after you and yours if that is the case. It is people with your attitude that allowed them free reign for so long. If anyone is responsible...it is those with your thinking. So by your logic...You deserve to die.
Nope, I'm not a muslim terrorist apologist. But I think I can understand the reasons why there are muslim terrorists. And I think I know that it doesn't help to go headless crazy.
Speaking of responsibles: Who supported the Talibans, Al Quaida, Iran, Iraq, Pinochet etc without any thought for the consequences? Now these consequences are showing. USA has to pay the bills for their foreing policy. Thats all. Nothing to complain about. Just carry it as if you are a man.
Afraid not Ducky. ou certainly are justifying their actions. Making excuses for them. ou are exactly what they want. As much as the three amigos from turkey. There is no REASON for what they do. So yes Ducky...you are a muslim terrorist apologist. And they love you for it.
Now...AGAIN you will be told... The US never supported the taliban. Nor Al Qaeda. Iran when not run by whacked out terrorist weird-beards...yes. And Iraq...yes. Now...If I give you a gun to protect yourself...and you use it to rob a liquor store...the fault is with YOU Ducky. When you get that in your head you'll look a lot less like a terrorist sympathizer. he US is NOW paying the bills for the weak-willed policy that you support. The US does carry...YOUR load. When will you man up?
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"Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it, misdiagnosing it and them misapplying the wrong remedies." --Groucho Marx
In many legal systems there is a definition,"conducting war or warlike operations..
Only nation states have the power to declare war,so it follows that the operations of terrorists are not war,but warlike operations,since they have no basis in law they are terrorist acts and in my opinion the place to try them is before a military tribunal...